Sexwork Cyber Center
By Dave in Phoenix dave@davephx.com
PO Box 55045, Phoenix AZ 85078-5045
Promoting Intimacy and Other-Centered Sexuality

"Spot the Katoey Game" which most men will lose at
A discussion on asfo

Someone says (not Dave)
And then they want to know how they can spot the katoey's that they're so terrified of! Hahahahaha! ROTFLMAO!! Oh boy, have I got bad news for them!! 

I've got a homework assignment for our fledgling asfo'ers. Go to any of the King's Group bars in Patpong. Go in and slowly walk around, get a good look at all the girls. How many katoeys did you count? OK. Now, sit down and call the mamasan over. Let her sit with you and buy her some drinks (colas). Chat her up and casually ask her how many katoeys she has working there. What? You don't believe her? Ok, now you have a number to work with. Time to play "Spot the katoeys", take another walk around. Whatsamatter? Can't find them all? Not even close to finding that many? Eye-opener isn't?

These morons that claim that they can spot katoeys and are sure that no bargirl they've been with was katoey are full of shit. Why? Because there are three kinds of katoeys out there, the ugly ones that anybody would spot, the beautiful ones that range from easy to very difficult to spot, and the ones that are flat impossible to spot.

How is it possible for a born man to be so impossible to spot as a woman? Don't believe it do you? Katoeys get to be they way they are due to hormonal imbalances starting in the womb. These imbalances vary in severity. The katoeys you can spot probably looked like males when they were teenagers. But some katoeys produce little or no male hormones in their bodies from birth. This means that at puberty their feet and hands didn't get big, their voice didn't change, no facial hair, no adams apple. Without masculinizing hormones they always appeared female with only the naughty bits down below to betray them. All it takes is for your friendly Bangkok surgeon to turn the outie into an innie and now not even a General Practitioner's medical exam could tell. Only a GYN could find out. Scary, huh?

And if you think there are only a few, ten, maybe a hundred of them, think again. Thailand's surgeons are the best in the world at sex-change ops and its because they get lots of practice. They're cranking them out every day like Domino's makes pizzas. Try thousands. And guess where they all get work? That's right, in all the beer-bars, go-go joints, and freelance hangouts that the real girls do.

So the answer to the question "How do you make sure to spot all the katoeys?" is "You can't". 

So listen up newbies! It's clue time! This is Thailand. Katoeys go with the territory. It's unavoidable. Denial doesn't change this. Name calling doesn't change this. I know this is going to be hard on you, but you've probably fucked one or two already whether you know it or not. Every time you march in here to reaffirm your manhood you stamp "Clueless Newbie" on your forehead and half the list is laughing at you, not with you. If it walks like a duck, looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, who the hell cares if last year or even last week it was an ostrich? Hint: You don't get to be an old hand until you stop worrying about it.

 Here is even a website to meet gorgeous  katoeys !

A Big Difference Between A Transsexual  and A Transvestite
DAVE Replies:
From prior discussions it seems in Thailand just like in the U.S. there is also 2 larger subtypes.

The first are what in the U.S. are transvestites (TV), which are men just dressing up in drag for fun and perhaps enjoy fooling people and getting the shock reaction when the man finds out she is a he.

But the second group which it far larger at least in the U.S. is the true female, with the genetic defect which creates the terrible result of nature of being a women trapped in a male sexual body. This is the transsexual (TS) who isn't playing any games like the transvestite, but desperately want the sex change operation to align their gender and their physical sexuality. 

Just like some gays, they sometimes go to extremes of acting out since they are treated as such oddities anyway in our culture they flaunt it just as some gays do. But for the vast majority, at least in the U.S., they are desperate for support and want to be treated as real people not as a genetic mistake.

BTW, in the womb we are all female to start. Based on genetics different hormones cause our sexual organs to develop either male or female. Men...look at the back of your penis. See the line? That is where your vagina would be if your penis developed as a female instead of male. We are all just a chromosome away from being the opposite sex and we all have the same internal sex structure that just develops differently. That is why for example, many women can ejaculate, just like men. The sexually plumbing has developed differently but it is all there male or female.

Regardless if one is a Katoey, gay, bi, or straight, Black, White, Indian, Asian, or Western, we are all most importantly the same human race, with the same emotional desires to love, play, be sexually fulfilled etc. To me what is the same is more important than looking at what is different.

If you are like me, an extreme heterosexual (didn't choose it that's how I was born), no one is forcing us to have sex which is icky to us (other men icky to me). But all deserve the same respect that we would want if we happened to be born a minority sexual orientation of with a cruel fate of a genetic error like the transsexual.

While I am very sympathetic with the TS, I have no such support of the TV who is just playing a game having fun deceiving people. I understand both types are common in Thailand as in most all of the world. But since some of the best in the world sex change surgery is available in Thailand, I suspect there are many TS's that in my view need support, not ridicule. 

On the other hand...I'm not sure the true TS'x are in bars pretending to be girls.... Except that their gender is female and they seek male friendships and sensual interactions (even if not full sex) just like "real women" do who are lucky enough to be both female in gender and physical sexuality. I do not support them however in their deception. Yet how else are they going to find companionship from a heterosexual male that will have them knowing the truth. They clearly are not gay but truly female in emotional gender. A gay does not desperately want to have female breasts (just icky fat cells to them) etc.

They can be too aggressive however
And desperate enough to be pickpockets
I know they're there because they tried to work me one night. Luckily all they got was some loose change. Their tactic is to walk up, mouthing "let's go hotel", and start grabbing your crotch. Soon others join in and you're surrounded. While you're distracted they search your pockets. I encountered them on the Landmark side of Sukhumvit near a very deserted section. But I've also seen them on the other side of Sukhumvit. They seem to just hang out, some look pretty buzzed and freaky. I think they wait for guys that look buzzed walking home from NEP alone when no one else is around. I don't think they hit every guy that comes by, it's just an opportunity thing. Going from NEP to Thermae, you could take a tuk-tuk or taxi, cheaper than losing your wallet. If you walk, try to tag up with other people walking to give the impression you're together. They'll wait for easier pickings. I don't understand why the tourist police can't do anything, they're a well known hazard on Sukhumvit. Probably too busy collecting NEP payments. - Ken

Another said:
There's a pack of pickpocketing katoeys to watch out for down around Soi 5-11 but they only work after midnight. Avoid walking after midnight.>

How the hell do you safely get from NEP to Thermae at 2am after they close the NEP bars? I walked that area between midnite and 5 am several times, a round trip every night, never had a problem, but I've been warned by a local about the same thing.