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By Dave in Phoenix
dave@davephx.com
PO Box 55045, Phoenix AZ 85078-5045

Promoting Intimacy and Other-Centered Sexuality

Thailand Intimacy & Healthy (Adult) Sexuality Research Report

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Thailand vs. the Philippines The Pros and Cons for Me

Obviously I very much enjoyed Thailand and there are pros and cons of each. But overall there really is no comparison - Thailand for me wins hand down over the Philippines (PI).

Since my PI reports on sexwork.com and my saying I would also soon be going to Thailand, I have received lots of E-mail from many men very interested in how I would compare PI vs. Thailand. Many are torn between those choices for first trips just as I was. Many men can't take the time or afford to go to both so they were asking my advice.

My suggestion to all has been that if at all possible, that they go to both PI and Thailand so they can make up their own minds based on their interests.

Before I went to PI, I was faced with the same question of whether I should go to PI or Thailand first. Experienced travelers highly suggested I go to PI first to get my Asian feet wet since for the newbe being able to converse better in English makes it a lot easier.

It was also suggested that once you experience the more open sexual attitudes of the Thai girls, PI might be a let down. I am glad I took that advice. Being my first trip to Asia, PI was a bit easier due to less language problems. Now I am more comfortable being in a different culture as an American with little foreign travel experience. I seem to be surviving quite well - even with the cabby getting lost trying to get me to my Pattaya Hotel!

The only real PI advantage is much better English, although it was still hard to understand most bargirls. But some had much better English than anyone I have met in Thailand - other than of course Long Gun, but he isn't a girl so he doesn’t count. This I'm sure is due to English being required learning in PI schools early and English is an official second language in PI, unlike in Thailand.

The English advantage in PI is not that significant however, especially with the bargirls. Many dropped out of school in 6th grade to help their families farm or whatever in their villages. They spoke no English for many years and then start working in the bars. I found 90% of most bargirls English just has hard to understand as most Thai's. Also in their tagalog sp? native language they don't pronounce certain vowels. This makes it just as hard to understand for me than the tonal language of Thai's.

To some extend if as visitors we choose not to take the time to learn Thai, that is more our problem. Yet, it is a big factor in our decision where to go to enjoy the women of the world. But not knowing Thai does make any meaningful intelligent girlfriend conversing (verbal intimacy) almost impossible at least for me during my first trip. Yet I know there are some Thai girls that do speak good English, they are just rarer in Thailand than in PI.

In PI I like the fact the "Guest Relationship Officers" (GRO’s) have to be STD tested weekly and tested for HIV monthly. I realize sometimes they cheat but in Thailand while some bars seem to require testing to be hired, there seems to be no ongoing test requirements. However the HIV rate is quite low in Bangkok and Pattaya compared to the villages in the northern provinces.

The irony is that in Thailand sexwork is acknowledged as a big part of the economy, even though many Thai's don't like it. In PI even with GRO's required by law to have the weekly STD tests, supposedly they don't have sex. 

PI has vastly more corruption with police looking for bribes all the time, armed police all over even heavily armed security guards at the Manila McDonald's - (must be for a reason) etc. As someone said, "In all the years I have lived in the Philippines, I adopted an attitude that my idea of an honest cop was one that when you bribed him he stayed bribed!" In Thailand the Tourist Police actually help you, instead of looking for an excuse to get a bribe from you.

Thailand has a much safer feeling on the streets - just don't have an elephant back into you around Nana Plaza. The elephants seem more a risk in Thailand than the street people. There also seems to be far less poverty of street people in Thailand at least form my street walking observations in Bangkok and Manila. Angeles City and Pattaya both have much lower crime concerns than Manila or Bangkok and all the adult entertainment is in one much larger area than the various more scattered areas of Bangkok and especially Manila.

Due to the political situation I probably will never return to PI, I have been warned I might even be on immigration's banned from entry list simply for the report on my website, where I was so careful to explain companion fees are not for sex, only company. And in a couple cases that is exactly what happened. I did enjoy some good intimacy for example with one long-term (which is all they do) girl but she didn’t want to show her naked front or have sex, which I respected.

My research report on sexwork.com made some bar owners in Angeles City upset with me and all my posts were banned form a Angeles City mailing list due to fears it was politically incorrect and might make the authorities give the bars a hard time. After that I certainly have no interest in returning to PI but it’s more related to the political dishonest situation and games you have to play in PI than the bargirls and bars.

The bargirls in Thailand seem refreshingly more comfortable with nudity and sexuality, probably due to their Buddhism vs. Catholic PI dominated culture. But they are more pros in Thailand who seem to need to perform as soon as they hit the bed vs. more intimacy-enjoying girls I experienced in PI. Yet I was successful in getting the Thai girls out of their routine and all seemed to love the more intimate sexuality I prefer.

Girls in PI are less pros but I prefer the short-term (often about 2 hour) barfines in Thailand unless I really found someone I liked. I also like the fact there are so many short-term cheap hotel rooms in Thailand so I don't have to always bring them back to my hotel as I did in PI. In PI I never found any short-term available.

There are few massage places in PI, and I have enjoyed the sort of structured sensual experience of massage in Thailand. The body/body massages in Thailand are totally different from anything in PI and very sensually wonderful!

I am a bit more physically attracted to the Thai looking women vs. Filipino, but the attraction difference isn’t huge. There is a very wide variety of physical characteristics in both places. Finding physically attractive women hasn’t been any problem in either place. And certainly MUCH easier than in the U.S…at least for women I’d ever have a chance with.

Both the Philippines and Thailand have lots of beautiful scenic areas and both have many other non-sexual related activities that I might explore more on later visits. Thailand probably has somewhat more variety and other interesting Asian countries are closer to visit if I wanted to on future trips.  

Thailand seems to be  a much more modern country than the PI. It is easier to get to non-sex tourist sites.  Thailand has  better train, bus and airline service to anywhere you might want to go.  Hotels are much more upscale overall for about the same price as lower quality hotels in PI.   

In Thailand you can go by bus or train and visit Malaysia, Burma, and Laos, or short airline flights to  Vietnam and Cambodia. These countries have their own interesting cultures as well as the long-traditions of brothels and lots of women wanting to be with you.

Thai's also seem to be a much happier independence loving people, have their own rich cultural heritage instead of being colonized and at the mercy of so many foreigners in PI.  Their Buddhism seems to make then less judgmental and accepting of different social views (homosexuality, katoeys even sex tourists...much more accepted in Thailand than in PI.)

Negative points of Angeles City are that it has no scenic at all, itís just a dusty small place. There are no beer bars or beaches . Also thereís no Tourist Police or any ATM machines in AC. 

All and all AC is a very charming little place which cannot be compared with anything else and so is Pattaya. I think the best is enjoy both and have the best of both worlds.

In summary, I detest the political situation in PI and having to pretend sexwork doesn't exist and knowing some girls in PI are quite inhibited vs. what I've experienced in Thailand. All of these comparisons are only based on my limited first time experience which will total just under 2 weeks in each country. But I have also done a lot of research and listening to comments by many others who have spent a great deal more time in both countries..

I hope to return to Thailand frequently in the future since on balance, for me, I enjoy it more than any place else I've experienced.

Here are some other posted views:


Pattaya is the party capital of the world! It IS Spring Break on hormones! I just returned from BKK, Mae Sai (north), Pattaya, several Thai islands and Africa. All in a drunken, hard dicked frenzy. I do like BKK for some things, but party in Pattaya, the Islands or Patong on Phuket (poo-ket, not foo-ket!) more often then not. I now co-own a bar in Phuket and Pattaya (pat-yah) and BKK. Who'd of thought. P.P. Cambodia is still fun, but one must keep his head clear, some danger does still spew forth. A buddy was recently stabbed in the belly while trying to fight off would-be robbers in Manila, Philippines. He ended up seriously wounding the muggers, and now faces trial in the Phil. I warned him that he should simply kill any such hostile force and run like the wind, but he failed to listen to the knowledge of war and law and life. 

Thailand has no such troubles. And I've walked nearly every street in BKK and Pattaya as drunk as a skunk... no problems. In short, one can have fun in places in SE Asia outside of Thailand. But you best have some travel sense and a set of firm balls and quick fists. 

Doc Bill


Another (author unknown)
This is my subjective analysis based on personal experience of living and traveling in Asia for over 25 years. Besides dating/bedding a wide variety of the highly diverse stock on the continent itself and in the west, I have listened to varying opinions for years from many of the world's great asia philes. Not to boast, but I have first-hand experience bedding a few - to many - Thais, Lao, Khmer, Burma (Burmese), Indonesian (Malay, Javanese, Sudanese, etc.), Filipinas, Han Chinese, Korean, Japanese plus various ethnic "hill tribe" minorities like, Mien (Yao), Hmong (Meo), Thai Yai (Shan), etc. In no particular order I rate the following:

THAIS - Northern puying (girls) are by far the most prized by the locals and East Asian tourists. They are fair skinned and often more attractive and "meatier," or bigger chested than the average Thai girl. Also, a large number are racially mixed (Hill Tribe, Thai-Yai, Chinese, etc.). Darker-skinned girls from Isaan (northeast Lao and Khmer mix) Thailand dominate the bar scene, coming from the poorest region of the country and are the most accessible to farangs. This amuses most Bangkok residents and certainly upper-class Thai society. It would seem these Isaan "fun-sanukers," with their heavy "country bumkin" accent and often crude, uneducated manerisms have stereotyped them as good for only three things; taxi driver (male) and either hotel maid or prostitute for females. Thai legend has it that the most beautiful girls are from the towns of Lamphun and Lampang near Chiang Mai. Thousands of Thais flock to the spectacular annual Loy Kratong festvial (held just last week) in Chiang Mai to view the colorful floats carrying what they view as the number one parade of the most beautiful Thai girls. The average Thai working girl is about 5'2." She is much cleaner than the average S.E. Asian. A Shower before sex, after sex and inbetween sex! Watch out for that "killing Buddhist smile" and don't be so intoxicated by her incredible looks, silky smooth skin and other considerable charms that you ignore the competition which is often more than just skin deep. Face: 8 Body: 7 Attitude: 6 Marriage: 5 Sex: 6 Overall: 7

FILIPINAS - A brainwashed, guilt ladden Catholic background (with the exception of the small minority of Muslim girls you may run into) must always be considered when dealing with the various blends in the basket-case Philippines. Perhaps no where in Asia can you find such a wide variance of body shapes, hues, racial/facial characteristics, etc. The average Filipina bar girl is perhaps 5'2" or less and unlike most Thais wants to marry you 5 minutes from the time you sit down next to her. Oh, and it would be nice if you would adopt her 2 year old baby as well. She could have one of the the best asses and biggest tits you'll find anywhere or so flat she could pass for a 14 year old boy.  Face: 5 Body: 6 Attitude: 6 Marriage: 5 Sex: 6 Overall: 5


The Professor writes me with permission to share:
I have some experience with Phillipine women and extensive experience with Thai women. I worked as Diplomatic Courier for periods of time totalling about 5 years, so I had the opportunity to "indulge" without the expense of the travel. I only ever got to stay in Manila about 5 or 6 times, but on all occasions except one, the night ended with a distinct downside.

The one good occasion, the girl had the bar-name "Lorna", so I'll call her that. This was in the late 70's so almost certainly she is no longer working. I (obviously) got Lorna from a bar, and right from the start, she surprised me. We were in the taxi going back to the hotel, and stopped at traffic lights. Several street urchins came and rapped on the taxi's window. She opened her handbag and gave these children some small change, explaining to me that "it's nearly Christmas". In the hotel room, she was extremely accommodating (pun not intended), and we slept wrapped closely in each other's arms. The next day, I asked her why she worked as a bar-girl. Her reply was simple and ironic; I had a husband who started to go out with other women, so now I go out with other men. I arranged to see her again that night, I couldn't take her with me during the day as I had an Embassy Christmas lunch.

Looking back on our meeting and togetherness, for the brief time that we had together, we were as close as if we had known one another for a few years and had suddenly become lovers.

That was my single good experience with a Filipina. The others, including one in Singapore, were unashamedly making no secret of the fact that they were only interested in "earning their money" as quickly as possible, then departing the scene equally quickly (with money in purse, of course).

I'll admit that half-a-dozen "meetings" is a small sample compared to what is available, but even so, a <16% satisfaction rate is not good.

On the other side of the coin, of the innumerable encounters that I have had with Thai women, there has been but one where I was dissatisfied with what I got. She did the deed, took the money, and departed.

I have had relationships with Thai women of all ages from 15 to 50 (take that figuratively, not literally), and I can honestly say that except for the one bad one, they are the most loving women that I have encountered on the face of this earth.


Inside the life of a Philippines Bargirl who is shown Bangkok and Pattaya By SanMig2009 Excerpts used with his permission. This experience confirms what others have posted about the jealousy, mood swings etc of PI girls.

At some point I tell her we're getting married at Christmas and she's a very happy girl. Back at the hotel she shows me her new tits. Apparently the belly boys take a product called Diane 35 to develop breasts and she's taking this to enhance her boobs. It works.

Lowlight of the day was a visit to her home to be inspected by her brother and sisters and passed as a fit and proper person to take her out the country. Never been there before, the whole area looks pretty unsavoury so I've always stayed in the trike while she disappears into the ditch. She lives in a squat. No proper pathways, water and sewage running every where. Her home consists of a breeze block construction comprising 3 rooms, about 10 x 6 ft and a corridor. Here live Y, 4 of her sisters, her brother, 3 partners, 14 of their children, and to give it a cosy feel 3 cousins are staying for a few weeks. About 25 people in all. Apparently they sleep "sardine style". Y's room is at the back. It's locked, she unlocks it and inside is a large part of her family, 3 sisters and their children sitting on the bed watching the TV. She has the only TV so it doubles as the TV room. The washing machine's also in there. I'm invited to sit on the bed. I know 2 of her sisters and am introduced to the other two. The news of our forthcoming marriage seems to be received positively and I try to count my prospective in-laws. A large bottle of San Mig is produced to celebrate and my future brother in law drinks it. The sisters tell me of their plans to set up a small business, a carenderina, and I wonder where they could raise the money for such an enterprise. Eventually she retrieves her passport and we leave - back to the hotel for a shower. I recall with a shudder that she's several times suggested that I should stay at her apartment rather than paying for a hotel.

(They then go to BKK and she enjoys seeing the bars and gogo's in Bangkok, comparing them to where she works in Angles City,Philippines.)

Thai girls have "bad blood"(aids). I'm not allowed to consort with Thai girls, "Just look. No touch, no kiss". Apparently, Thailand is held out to the Filipina bargirls as an example of what'll happen to them if they don't use condoms.

She tells me about her previous career at the Tiger Club, which used to be situated near Checkpoint. Private shows by candle light. Toro-Toro shows. Cherry girls being deflowered on stage. Not sure how true this is. Maybe she's just trying to trump the Thai girls.

The "dirty blood" thing had resurfaced. Y's complaining about the food. "Alien food" is making her stomach churn. Have to fed her at McDonalds.

By taxi to Pattaya - Welkome Inn. Stroll down and look at the beach. Y looks at it and pronounces it dirty, she wants to go tothe "isla". We walk along Beach Road and explore a couple of soi's. The sun ain't shining and the overall effect is pretty depressing. Y starts on about going back to Angeles tommorow, understandably.

Y's in "dirty blood" mode again. We scout the go go's. She attempts to give me an underwater blowjob in the pool at Welkome but only succeeds in losing an earing. It ends up with all the katoeys from the show parading round the pool trying to spot the earing. After a few rum and cokes she gets into conversation with these two lovely Thai girls. She shows them her tits, they compare bra's and panties, all the usual girlie things. She doesn't believe me afterwards when I tell her they were katoeys.

I'm in the deepest shit. On the beach I'd been approached by the massage girls and I'd explained that Y'd go loopy if I was given a massage, but I asked them to give her a massage. She's called over, yes she'd like a massage, and yes she's like a manicure, so off they go. The third girl's sitting there and she says, "she's got work and she's got work, but I've got no work, you like a foot massage?". I don't think there can be much harm in that so, OK. The foot massage includes massage of the lower leg and I've got old tear injuries in my calves. When these are tweaked it hurts, and I open my eyes and look down. I then notice a change in the atmosphere and I look over and Y is looking mean. A minute or two later she gets up and walks away. I follow her and ask what's up. "You were looking at that girl" She won't accept any explanation. Things are still tense when we get back to the hotel. I was looking at the girl, I want to fuck around with the Thai girls, Thai girls dirty blood etc etc. This is the last night in Thailand and it starts off in misery. For the best part of the evening she won't talk

There's a lesbian show at a go go at the top of soi Post Office so I reckon I may as well go and see that. Well, Y's mood changes. She likes the show, she walks right over to the stage to get a close look at the vibrator beeing used. Afterwards, she chats with the girls, she likes the girls, she asks me to barfine them. Uhh, OK. This is the 11.30 shift and we are back in the hotel by 12.30. I set the alarm for 5am (taxi's at 6) and we go through to 5. One of the girls is 23 and one 19 ( I believe the names were Pol and Ami respectively). You'd think a girl who gets penetrated by a vibrator on stage would be pretty hardcore, but Ami had never given a blowjob before. Pol had a mouth like a vacuum cleaner and she'd learned to say "I want you to come in my mouth" but in a recognisably Brit accent. We mixed and matched, but I would guess Pol is bisexual and she spent a lot of time with Y and I spent alot of time with Ami. I gave her a shave and shot a couple of rolls of film. Y has a good time and really gets on with the girls. They say goodbye like old friends parting. Unfortuntely, they kiss me and say "Come back soon." I'll be reminded about this later.

(They now get back to Manila from Bangkok)

For reasons not clear to me Y blames me for the rain. She losses her rag and all the bile comes out. For 5 or 6 hours I'm stuck with her in the taxi and she's going on about fucking around with Thai girls. I decide the marriage is off (I'd decided that before for various reasons, smoking, make up, inability to walk anywhere, jealousy, but this gives me an excellent reason to hang the break on) so I let her go on. When we get to the hotel she hangs back and doesn't come into the room for about 15 mins. She knows she's gone too far. When she slinks in I tell her. She sits in nthe chair with her head in her hands for about 30 mins. Then, she starts the "I want to talk serious" routine and how she was only joking, but I tell her "No, break". She asks if I want her to cut her wrists "for remembrance" and I tell her it won't make any difference. She tries drawing the clasp of her watch over her wrist, with little result. She then starts looking for something sharper and starts rummaging in my toilet bags. I suddenly remember I have a cut-throat razor so I leap out of bed, grab the bags and lock them in my rucksack. She can't find anything to cut her wrists with so she gradually settles down and tells me she's sorry and so on. We eventually fall asleep on opposite sides of the bed.

In the morning. She acts as if nothing had happened. So do I. I don't want to precipitate another wrist slashing attempt. A couple of times she asks "We get married December" and I say "Possibly". This is the last night of my holiday and it's ending on a sour note. Y doesn't want to go home and see her family. I think she wants to keep an eye on me. In the evening we bar hop. We go into Misty's and one of her sisters, Emma, is dancing there (started the day before). They're reunited and I buy her a ladies drink so she can sit with us and Y can tell her about the holiday. She goes to the loo, and while she's there her older sister, Elsie the peanut vendor, comes in. Emma tells Elsie that I've come back from BKK but Y has stayed there and the poor girl has a fit. She only calms down when Y comes back from the loo. We move on to Diamond and Gold. They have topless dancers and a lesbian show involving total nudity and mouth to pussy contact, but not as good as the one I'd seen last night. And who's that girl dancing topless? It's the one who got married last week. And what's she doing with that fat bald guy? And why is he holding her hand and leading her towards the exit? She must find married life boring already. from there we hit a few more bars, but the evening fizzled out, I couldn't even drink. There was no passion between me and Y, I was just kicking my heels waiting for the taxi. We spent the final hour apart, I was in my room and she was in the pool area chatting with her sister. We said goodbye when the taxi came and she asked me to e-mail her soon. 1 3/4 hrs to the airport. I'm still working on that e-mail. And looking forward to hitting Angeles as a single man again.

Regarding his post: It wasn't meant to be a cautionary tale, it was just the way things worked out. I've spent 3 holidays with her in PI and she's a really good natured person. 1 week in Thailand and she turns into the moody monster. I couldn't handle that on a permanent basis. I think part of it was that she's generally frightened about catching aids (quite rightly) and sees Thai girls as an excellent way of contracting it. She doesn't seem to mind the occasional night absent with a filipina, provided I use a condom, but she knows the risk level in Angeles. It's difficult to talk things through in any degree of subtlety with her because her English isn't up to it, and I left within 28 hours of her harangue in the taxi while the atmosphere was thoroughly poisoned.

I don't think her attitude, presumably to infidelity, is a problem because she's a bargirl. She allows me a lot more latitude than the girl next door would and she's also open to sociable sex.

I'm not influenced by her home circumstances, except that I considered renting her an appartment, they're pretty cheap. I've seen various girls homes in Angeles, all the others were regular rented accommodation and nicely kept, if sometimes a little on the cramped side. This is the first experience I've had of a squat and it made quite an impression on me. Incidentally, the family income must be reasonably good. 3 of the sisters are working in the bars, one of these is receiving support from their boyfriend and has a husband who is working, and another one receives support, but she's not working. If they wished they could afford better accommodation, but I think the sisters like to stick together.


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